GClark
New member
Shamelessly stolen from another forum:
What is a coilover?
Wikipedia Wrote:
The technical mumbo-jumbo is nice, but what does that mean for me?
Well, it means that you would be replacing your stock suspension with a part that is far more customizable. Keep in mind that your stock suspension was engineered to be a particular way for a mass-market car. Replacing that can have both great advantages and great disadvantages. You will most likely be sacrificing ride quality for full customization of a couple of ride variables, but it will give you the option to better tune your suspension experience for the type of driving you do. Whether or not you NEED a full coilover is something that takes great consideration.
A few of the things you should ask yourself before deciding to purchase coilovers are:
-What type of driving do I do?
-What kind of ride am I looking for?
-What is my reasoning for purchasing coilovers?
-What is my budget like?
-How much time will I be spending in traffic/on-the-track/canyon-carving/off-road?
-Is a full coilover the right kind of suspension for accomplishing my goals?
So, why would I want coilovers?
There are a couple of reasons for it, really.
1) I want my car to be slammed.
I have no argument that sports cars look better a little lower than typical stock ride height (or "Monster truck status", as you will hear many people say). Some people prefer to have their car with minimal ground clearance, as it is aesthetically pleasing to them. There are a lot of technical blunders in lowering your car TOO far, however; you may experience serious dynamic camber loss under compression. Coilover systems are not always the go-to solution that people think they are. If you only want them for ride height, you can probably benefit more from an adjustable coilover sleeve (like the ones made by Eibach/Ground Control) and an upgraded strut (KYB GR2 or AGX, or Koni adjustable inserts), as they are MUCH cheaper than most full coilovers and you don't have to worry about the possible issue of having a poorly built one blowing out while you're driving.
coilover sleeves - cheaper than full systems
2) I want to race my car.
Having a fully adjustable part won't benefit you crap unless you know exactly what you are adjusting for. A long time ago I learned while playing Gran Turismo that a lot of the modifications you can buy won't make you faster if you don't know how to use them. If you just want to upgrade your gearbox to a better one, that's cool, but it's not monetarily worth it if you don't know how to adjust it to benefit you. The advantage to coilover systems is that very level of adjustment - from adjusting camber to damping force to ride height to anything else, you can customize it. Meaning that you can just as easily set yourself up for failure as you can for circuit dominance. If you don't know what you are doing, you should probably research it, then research it again. You may be equally better off going with a good performance spring (like the Tanabe GF210 or Cobb springs) and upgraded struts (see above) and some good sway bars to make sure that you are able to more aggressively drive your car.
3) I want to totally adjust my ride.
Ok, this is FAR more noble an approach than most take. If this is your reasoning, good for you. Now make sure that you know what exactly you are undertaking. Many coilover systems will advertise that they are two-way or four-way or 32-way adjustable. The more ways advertised doesn't necessarily mean that it is even better. Usually when it says "32-way", it means that there are 32 settings for damping adjustment, and they are most likely still 2-way adjustable. To better explain that, I will borrow this quote from ButtDyno from Nasioc:
Quote:
Moton full coilover system. Hella adjustable. Hella expensive.
4) Coilovers are for k00 k00 herraJDMyo rides.
Please shoot yourself in the face. Seriously, though, it's your money, and if you want to blow it on an entirely unnecessary part, then game on.
Ok, why would I NOT want coilovers?
Again, they are not the end-all of suspension parts. Your suspension is an entire system of devices, from sway bars to endlinks to lateral links to top hats to struts to springs to camber bolts to 400 other parts. Buying coilovers will not immediately fix all suspension issues. If your problem is with body roll, you might want to consider new sway bars. If you have a problem with lift under cornering, you may want to pick up a good ALK (anti-lift kit) or "compliance kit". Also, high quality coilover systems are very costly, and you may be looking to spend anywhere from $2500 to $10,000 for a system from reputable companies. Also, keep in mind that your coils don't technically have an expiration date, but they WILL wear out and need to be rebuilt. Whether they will just need to be sent in to be revalved or totally rebuilt, keep in mind different companies have different policies and prices on having this service done.
Parts like the Hotchkis TVS might be a better approach to solving your suspension woes than just dumping money on new coils.
Why is there so much debate over such a simple part?
There is no easy way to answer this. Much like a lot of components of your vehicle, it is both simple and complex at the same time. The parts may be straightforward, but what it is composed of might not be. Frequently, less reputable manufacturers use cheap materials to make replicas of higher grade parts. The price difference between Moton coilovers and CXRacing coilovers could well be research and engineering, or grade of parts, or any combination of things.
Ok, I definitely want them, might even need them; which should I buy?
Really, it depends on what you are trying to accomplish with them. Tein (among other companies) offers a whole slew of models for different purposes, be they just for tarmac, or for curcuit racing, or for gravel racing, or even basic ones to improve ride handling and appearance. Again, keep in mind a couple of things -
-Am I buying these to address a problem I have, or just because it's the next step?
-Am I making myself poor by investing in these, and is it worth it?
-If someone gave me a set of these, would I put them on my car?
-What is the reputation of the brand?
-What are the repair/rebuild policies of the brand?
-How much support is there for the brand and model?
Keep in mind that just because someone says that Cusco is teh bestest coilover EVAAA because they're hellaJDM and that BC Racing is trash because they had a friend's sister's buddy who knows from his 800awhp moster doesn't mean it's entire true. Adversely, people who say that Megan coilovers are amazing and anyone who would spend more than the price for those is a moron are equally wrong. If it is a mechanical part, chances are that it WILL fail. It's just a question of time. I know people who have never had a problem with their Teins, and I know people who would refuse to ever buy Tein again. A lot can be chocked up to personal experience, so make sure that you are just as subjective about reading reviews as the people writing reviews.
Aight, I pulled the trigger on xyz brand.
Good for you. Make sure you give us a full review of how they appear, how they ride, what kind of driving you do, how much stress you put them under, and check in periodically so we know how well they stood up to your driving - revisiting your review every six months would be great. Also, make sure that your review is not overly one-sided. You may not know a ton about suspension, or you may have spent the last 30 years revalving struts for a well-known corporation - either way, be very honest and straightforward about them. Whether they look like they were made by a $60 harbor freight tig welder or they were forged in the heavens by Thor himself, let us know. Just be totally honest. The last thing we need here is more people hating everyone else for not buying the type or brand of coilovers that they would have.
Remember - there really is no right and wrong to coilovers. Just more right for what you are trying to accpomplish. Make sure to ask around with a lot of people so that you end up with the right suspension components for your goals and your wallet. You may only be looking to dump your car for that auto salon look and don't care about how it handles. You may be looking to turn your car into a mean racing trailer queen. You may also be looking for the most comfortable to daily drive and still have a good, tight feeling car, all the while not breaking the bank. Ultimately, it will all come down to what you're spending, and what you're getting out of it. So research a lot and make sure you know what you want before you get it.
If you can't smile be all thumbs-up-like about your new coilovers like this dude, you shouldn't have bought them.
Special thanks to Turn-In Concepts, and Nasioc contributors ButtDyno and Unabomber, for helping me figure out how to set the record straight. For more reading, please go here:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthre...?t=1408733
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthre...?t=1383366
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthre...st21456062
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=171928
What is a coilover?
Wikipedia Wrote:
The technical mumbo-jumbo is nice, but what does that mean for me?
Well, it means that you would be replacing your stock suspension with a part that is far more customizable. Keep in mind that your stock suspension was engineered to be a particular way for a mass-market car. Replacing that can have both great advantages and great disadvantages. You will most likely be sacrificing ride quality for full customization of a couple of ride variables, but it will give you the option to better tune your suspension experience for the type of driving you do. Whether or not you NEED a full coilover is something that takes great consideration.
A few of the things you should ask yourself before deciding to purchase coilovers are:
-What type of driving do I do?
-What kind of ride am I looking for?
-What is my reasoning for purchasing coilovers?
-What is my budget like?
-How much time will I be spending in traffic/on-the-track/canyon-carving/off-road?
-Is a full coilover the right kind of suspension for accomplishing my goals?
So, why would I want coilovers?
There are a couple of reasons for it, really.
1) I want my car to be slammed.
I have no argument that sports cars look better a little lower than typical stock ride height (or "Monster truck status", as you will hear many people say). Some people prefer to have their car with minimal ground clearance, as it is aesthetically pleasing to them. There are a lot of technical blunders in lowering your car TOO far, however; you may experience serious dynamic camber loss under compression. Coilover systems are not always the go-to solution that people think they are. If you only want them for ride height, you can probably benefit more from an adjustable coilover sleeve (like the ones made by Eibach/Ground Control) and an upgraded strut (KYB GR2 or AGX, or Koni adjustable inserts), as they are MUCH cheaper than most full coilovers and you don't have to worry about the possible issue of having a poorly built one blowing out while you're driving.
coilover sleeves - cheaper than full systems
2) I want to race my car.
Having a fully adjustable part won't benefit you crap unless you know exactly what you are adjusting for. A long time ago I learned while playing Gran Turismo that a lot of the modifications you can buy won't make you faster if you don't know how to use them. If you just want to upgrade your gearbox to a better one, that's cool, but it's not monetarily worth it if you don't know how to adjust it to benefit you. The advantage to coilover systems is that very level of adjustment - from adjusting camber to damping force to ride height to anything else, you can customize it. Meaning that you can just as easily set yourself up for failure as you can for circuit dominance. If you don't know what you are doing, you should probably research it, then research it again. You may be equally better off going with a good performance spring (like the Tanabe GF210 or Cobb springs) and upgraded struts (see above) and some good sway bars to make sure that you are able to more aggressively drive your car.
3) I want to totally adjust my ride.
Ok, this is FAR more noble an approach than most take. If this is your reasoning, good for you. Now make sure that you know what exactly you are undertaking. Many coilover systems will advertise that they are two-way or four-way or 32-way adjustable. The more ways advertised doesn't necessarily mean that it is even better. Usually when it says "32-way", it means that there are 32 settings for damping adjustment, and they are most likely still 2-way adjustable. To better explain that, I will borrow this quote from ButtDyno from Nasioc:
Quote:
Moton full coilover system. Hella adjustable. Hella expensive.
4) Coilovers are for k00 k00 herraJDMyo rides.
Please shoot yourself in the face. Seriously, though, it's your money, and if you want to blow it on an entirely unnecessary part, then game on.
Ok, why would I NOT want coilovers?
Again, they are not the end-all of suspension parts. Your suspension is an entire system of devices, from sway bars to endlinks to lateral links to top hats to struts to springs to camber bolts to 400 other parts. Buying coilovers will not immediately fix all suspension issues. If your problem is with body roll, you might want to consider new sway bars. If you have a problem with lift under cornering, you may want to pick up a good ALK (anti-lift kit) or "compliance kit". Also, high quality coilover systems are very costly, and you may be looking to spend anywhere from $2500 to $10,000 for a system from reputable companies. Also, keep in mind that your coils don't technically have an expiration date, but they WILL wear out and need to be rebuilt. Whether they will just need to be sent in to be revalved or totally rebuilt, keep in mind different companies have different policies and prices on having this service done.
Parts like the Hotchkis TVS might be a better approach to solving your suspension woes than just dumping money on new coils.
Why is there so much debate over such a simple part?
There is no easy way to answer this. Much like a lot of components of your vehicle, it is both simple and complex at the same time. The parts may be straightforward, but what it is composed of might not be. Frequently, less reputable manufacturers use cheap materials to make replicas of higher grade parts. The price difference between Moton coilovers and CXRacing coilovers could well be research and engineering, or grade of parts, or any combination of things.
Ok, I definitely want them, might even need them; which should I buy?
Really, it depends on what you are trying to accomplish with them. Tein (among other companies) offers a whole slew of models for different purposes, be they just for tarmac, or for curcuit racing, or for gravel racing, or even basic ones to improve ride handling and appearance. Again, keep in mind a couple of things -
-Am I buying these to address a problem I have, or just because it's the next step?
-Am I making myself poor by investing in these, and is it worth it?
-If someone gave me a set of these, would I put them on my car?
-What is the reputation of the brand?
-What are the repair/rebuild policies of the brand?
-How much support is there for the brand and model?
Keep in mind that just because someone says that Cusco is teh bestest coilover EVAAA because they're hellaJDM and that BC Racing is trash because they had a friend's sister's buddy who knows from his 800awhp moster doesn't mean it's entire true. Adversely, people who say that Megan coilovers are amazing and anyone who would spend more than the price for those is a moron are equally wrong. If it is a mechanical part, chances are that it WILL fail. It's just a question of time. I know people who have never had a problem with their Teins, and I know people who would refuse to ever buy Tein again. A lot can be chocked up to personal experience, so make sure that you are just as subjective about reading reviews as the people writing reviews.
Aight, I pulled the trigger on xyz brand.
Good for you. Make sure you give us a full review of how they appear, how they ride, what kind of driving you do, how much stress you put them under, and check in periodically so we know how well they stood up to your driving - revisiting your review every six months would be great. Also, make sure that your review is not overly one-sided. You may not know a ton about suspension, or you may have spent the last 30 years revalving struts for a well-known corporation - either way, be very honest and straightforward about them. Whether they look like they were made by a $60 harbor freight tig welder or they were forged in the heavens by Thor himself, let us know. Just be totally honest. The last thing we need here is more people hating everyone else for not buying the type or brand of coilovers that they would have.
Remember - there really is no right and wrong to coilovers. Just more right for what you are trying to accpomplish. Make sure to ask around with a lot of people so that you end up with the right suspension components for your goals and your wallet. You may only be looking to dump your car for that auto salon look and don't care about how it handles. You may be looking to turn your car into a mean racing trailer queen. You may also be looking for the most comfortable to daily drive and still have a good, tight feeling car, all the while not breaking the bank. Ultimately, it will all come down to what you're spending, and what you're getting out of it. So research a lot and make sure you know what you want before you get it.
If you can't smile be all thumbs-up-like about your new coilovers like this dude, you shouldn't have bought them.
Special thanks to Turn-In Concepts, and Nasioc contributors ButtDyno and Unabomber, for helping me figure out how to set the record straight. For more reading, please go here:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthre...?t=1408733
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthre...?t=1383366
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthre...st21456062
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=171928