Used Forester question

S

sleepyone

New member
Hello, I found two different Foresters for sale but would like some advice. One is a 2002 with 87,000 miles and is in great condition and ready to drive and the asking price is $7995. The other is a 2004 with 141,000 miles and needs head gaskets and rear brakes. The asking price for the 2004 is $5999 and the dealer says it would be about $1400 for the head gaskets and brakes.

Now my conundrum is this: An older Forester with fewer miles for $7995? Will the head gaskets blow? Will I be looking at a big repair bill in a few thousand miles?

Or: A more recent Forester with a lot more miles, brand new head gaskets and rear brakes. And considering the asking price of $5999 plus $1400 for the repairs, I would be looking at about $500 less.

I haven't looked at either car in person so I can't really say which one is in better shape cosmetically.

Anyway, as someone who knows pretty much nothing about cars I thought I'd ask the forum for some advice. Would anyone have a preference between these two?

 
it all depends on the actual condition of the cars in question. a well treated 02 is going to be a better bet than a newer one with issues. mileage alone is not necessarily a bad thing, mainteance history and how carefully the car was driven (or beat on) is more important.

condition condition condition, if you don't know enough about cars in general to accurately assess condition, take somebody with you who does. alternatively, have a mechanic perform a PP! (pre purchase inspection) on each vehicle. yeh sure it'll cost you some $$$ but think of it as "used car purchase insurance."

little things may give you clues about previous owners...for instance radio station presets. punch the buttons on radio of car you're checking out. if it's easy listening then probly good....if it's death metal maybe you want to keep shopping!

 
how does the person know it needs new headgaskets? because it was driven until it died? because they've kept up on maintenence and was able to spot the warning signs? does it need new brakes because they wore through the pads and killed the rotors and calipers too? it's all about maintenence. a mystery used car is never a good one. unless you can get some maintenence history that shows a clear story, i'd stay away from that one.

i'd also play best and worst case scenarios.

02 low mileage

best case: bulletproof reliable car that you drive from here till eternity.

worst case: signs of trouble with the headgaskets at around 100k

04 high mileage

best case: you spend a bunch of money but get the reliable new styled car you desire

worst case: you spend a bunch of money and other demons show themselves that weren't taken car of properly before. spend more money.

 
Mark said:
how does the person know it needs new headgaskets? because it was driven until it died? because they've kept up on maintenence and was able to spot the warning signs? does it need new brakes because they wore through the pads and killed the rotors and calipers too? it's all about maintenence. a mystery used car is never a good one. unless you can get some maintenence history that shows a clear story, i'd stay away from that one.

i'd also play best and worst case scenarios.

02 low mileage

best case: bulletproof reliable car that you drive from here till eternity.

worst case: signs of trouble with the headgaskets at around 100k

04 high mileage

best case: you spend a bunch of money but get the reliable new styled car you desire

worst case: you spend a bunch of money and other demons show themselves that weren't taken car of properly before. spend more money.
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Thanks for the tips Mark. I know the 04 needs head gaskets because it's at a dealer being sold wholesale, as is, and the dealer told me in an email about the head gaskets and brakes. But even with that work done, it's still $500 less than the '02. $500 isn't that big of an issue, I just want to get a car that will not need $1500 worth of work within a couple of years.

I know it's almost a tossup. It's hard to tell from the photos but the newer car appears to be a bit dirty on the inside. At least the digital photos look kind of smudgy. And the photo of the engine on the '04 shows more rust on the metal parts where things are mounted.

 
Nigel Prodrive said:
it all depends on the actual condition of the cars in question. a well treated 02 is going to be a better bet than a newer one with issues. mileage alone is not necessarily a bad thing, mainteance history and how carefully the car was driven (or beat on) is more important.

condition condition condition, if you don't know enough about cars in general to accurately assess condition, take somebody with you who does. alternatively, have a mechanic perform a PP! (pre purchase inspection) on each vehicle. yeh sure it'll cost you some $$$ but think of it as "used car purchase insurance."

little things may give you clues about previous owners...for instance radio station presets. punch the buttons on radio of car you're checking out. if it's easy listening then probly good....if it's death metal maybe you want to keep shopping!
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Thanks for the advice Nigel. I guess the best thing for me to do is go look at the cars in question. Fortunately they are both at the same dealer (Evergreen Subaru). Unfortunately for me, I do not know anyone in Maine who can assess a car's condition. Does anyone know a reliable mechanic in the Auburn area I can take the cars to?

Thanks!

 
Pretty much count on replacing the head gaskets in any 2.5 that hasn't already had them replaced. And if they have been replaced, make sure they were replaced by a reputable place, and all Subaru OEM gaskets and stuff were used, or they will leak again.

 
IBratmanI said:
Pretty much count on replacing the head gaskets in any 2.5 that hasn't already had them replaced. And if they have been replaced, make sure they were replaced by a reputable place, and all Subaru OEM gaskets and stuff were used, or they will leak again.
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Thanks! The $1400 quote for new head gaskets and brake work was from Evergreen, which is where the car is for sale. So based on what I've read on these forums it seems safe to say they are a reputable place.

I'm starting to wonder if I should get a Subaru at all. I've owned 8 cars (three of them new) and I've never had an issue with head gaskets. Is this some failing that's common to Subaru?

 
Correction: The Evergreen price to replace the head gaskets and rear brake work is $1500, not $1400 as stated above. An insignificant difference but I wanted to be accurate.

 
didn't realize it was actually at a dealer, let alone a subaru dealer. talk with Joel at evergreen and get his take on that car. he'll steer you right. he knows cars come and go and if he thinks it's a good/bad idea he'll let you know.

 
also, think of headgaskets on the 2.5 as maintenence, not a major failure of a component. subarus are reliable as hell and take abuse like no other.

 
Mark said:
didn't realize it was actually at a dealer, let alone a subaru dealer. talk with Joel at evergreen and get his take on that car. he'll steer you right. he knows cars come and go and if he thinks it's a good/bad idea he'll let you know.
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Thanks Mark. What department does Joel work in?

 
I am finding both of the forestors are quite steep.

I am a mechanic of the extra terrestrial suby kind..so, my 2 cents cost half a penny.

based on looks I presume as "condition condition condition"... it is still steep.

and subaru is from japan, not maine. winterizing could be a decade long list of little chores, to headgaskets as a climax, if you keep one..and that is the normal path. It can be worse. of course.

 
boxer3main said:
I am finding both of the forestors are quite steep.

I am a mechanic of the extra terrestrial suby kind..so, my 2 cents cost half a penny.

based on looks I presume as "condition condition condition"... it is still steep.

and subaru is from japan, not maine. winterizing could be a decade long list of little chores, to headgaskets as a climax, if you keep one..and that is the normal path. It can be worse. of course.
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it's not a boat, and the cars are both less than 10 years old. winterizing is not any more of a chore on a subaru than any other car, and consists of very little.

 
^Ummmm, ok @boxer. Anyway, Subaru Head gasket issues are really only for the EJ25 naturally aspirated engine. None of the others have this problem. But rest assured, if they are replaced the right way, which Evergreen definitely will do, then they will be fine. I say go with the Evergreen one that needs the work, They stand behind there work and there cars.

 
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First of all. Ignore boxer's post. He has no clue wtf.

ALL NA 2.5's will have head gasket issues. Supposedly they corrected it later on, but others argue the design is just inherent to them leaking.

My 02 impreza had to have the same headgasket done. Blew it like clockwork close to 100k. I had Evergreen do the gasket job and the motor has been MINT ever since. And those who know me know I am not easy on my cars.

Once they are fixed, you can pretty much count on them never leaking again. If you are buying ANY car with an NA 2.5, and it does NOT have documentation of the head gaskets being done, either knock 1200 or so off the asking price OR buy it and budget for a headgasket job.

Other then that these cars are very very reliable, all it takes is good maintenance.

 
Thanks everyone for the very good advice. I plan on driving up to Evergreen in on Wednesday to check out the two Foresters.

@Boxer, I've been researching Foresters at regional and local Maine dealers and these prices are pretty much in line with what others are charging. Yes, they're a bit higher than some and they're a bit lower than others. Personally I think any car this old with as many miles should be around $3000 but what do I know. My first car ('74 Gran Torino) was purchased when it was only 5 years old with about 40,000 miles and cost $1500 so it's a bit of a sticker shock for me to see how much these cost but I chalk that up to Subarus retaining their value. At least here in Maine. They're all over the place!

 
aye. i just purchased a 2002 wrx with 80,000 for $7,000 and it's been lauded as a great deal. they do hold their value quite well

 
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